MozillaZine

Jesse Berst on Mozilla

Tuesday May 4th, 1999

Jesse Berst has an article on Open Source, in which he devotes a sentence to Mozilla. However, his thoughts seem to have come directly from Jamie Zawinski (like the thoughts of so many other journalists recently).

If you have the inclination, pick up a copy of "Breaking The News: How The Media Undermine American Democracy" for an interesting take on why American journalism has gone so wrong. Many of the ideas in the book can easily be applied to the tech journalism industry as well.

Thanks to Aleks Zawisza for the news.


#1 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by Alfonzo

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 12:56 PM

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Jesse Berst is a moron.

He posts crap like that for no other reason than to stir people up: all in the name of 'hits'.

The Mozilla project is doing just fine and it will be to my great pleasure to watch it suplant IE and give M$ a run for their money... eventually *forcing* M$ to be standards compliant.

It will take time, and work... but it *will* happen.

#2 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by OLEVariant

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 2:15 PM

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I wouldn't be so sure about that

#3 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by WankerDesk!

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 2:24 PM

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Jesse Berst is a bigger fool than I thought he was. That man love to stir up FUD, FUD and more FUD.

#4 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by noMozCompt

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 2:34 PM

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Perhaps I missed something, but... he didn't say anything anti-Mozilla, did he?

That JWZ happens to be a traitor, well, Jesse can't help noticing that. The whole world noticed that.

When Mozilla is finally released, the people will follow in our footsteps.

I know, he failed to recognize the horde of followers the Mozilla project has gained. Probably because most of us aren't programmers and don't show up in the Bugzilla databases too often...

#5 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by OLEVariant

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 2:41 PM

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Jamie a traitor?

I think not. Sounds to me like he's smart enough to realize when an ocean is too big to cross.

#6 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by mozineAdmin

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 2:49 PM

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OLEVariant,

Maybe, but what if that ocean of expectation was entirely of his own making?

#7 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by janahan

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 3:32 PM

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It was a TROLL, ignore it...

There is NO need for an army of coders for mozilla yet... in fact an army of coders will detriment the project, as it may lose focus, when what is required is a highly focused team of developers (which it has already). There are thousands of poeple testing out the nightly builds and M releases. these people are far more important at this stage rather than having more programmers. When mozilla reaches release stages, that is when more coders will come in.

#8 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by OLEVariant

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 3:41 PM

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What if it wasn't?

Think about it. Why would a talented individual like Jamie who has achieved/accomplished so many things in the computing industry up and leave Mozilla?

I've read enough about his work in the past to know that he's not a quitter.

I've seen many 'quitters' turn into doers, but I don't think I've ever seen a doer turn into a quitter.

I don't question whether Mozilla will be completed or not. I know it will. I'm just concerned with the timeframe surrounding it's final release.

I want very much for Mozilla to be a big hit in the marketplace. I've witnessed great products that competed with M$'s never come to full blossom because of the timing of the releases.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed!

#9 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by OLEVariant

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 3:45 PM

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To Janahan,

No need to call me a troll because I'm expressing my own opinions.

As far as I'm concerned that kind of behavior is counterproductive to the public sentiment of Mozilla.

#10 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by noMozCompt

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 3:46 PM

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Why JWZ quit? Three letters: AOL

#11 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by Swaps <swaps@netscape.net>

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 5:12 PM

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> The Mozilla project is doing just fine and it will be to my great pleasure to watch it suplant IE and give M$ a run for their money... eventually *forcing* M$ to be standards compliant.

I donot think M$ has any interest in making IE standards compliant as it is given free. They might get some deals for it when bundled with 3rd party apps. Instead I feel they are putting their resources more on their Office products to have web functionality and drive their web strategy through the sale of office products. Remember they make loads of money selling Office. I think they would want people to replace their IE with Office.

#12 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by Alfonzo

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 6:12 PM

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To Swaps:

That's all fine and dandy, however there is a rapidly growing number of web developers out there that have made it clear to both major browser makers that they WILL NOT implement proprietary tags and only code to standards.

From where I'm sitting it looks like Mozilla will be the worlds first 100% standards compliant browser ever.

Web developers around the world, of course, will druel over this and be quite happy... understandably so, I might ad.

This in turn will *force* MS to adhere to W3C standards.

#13 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by stephan <stephan@micropop.com>

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 8:10 PM

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It will not neccessarily *force* MS to comply to standards as proprietary Office-related functionality might be a sufficient reason for executives to choose IE.

Of course, this will result in lots of proprietary systems - elsewhere known as Intranets.

Standards are good, but they wont be enough to get rid of IE. Not everyone is a web developer.

#14 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by Alphonzo

Tuesday May 4th, 1999 10:51 PM

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Of course it will... and like I said before: Office has nothing to do with it.

If IE can't handle sites written to standards the market will force MS to be standards compliant.

MS updating their rendering engine to be standards compliant will have no effect on Office 2000... other than making it better.

#15 hey

by gnome

Wednesday May 5th, 1999 1:00 AM

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Just bitching about mozillas failiure won't make it finished faster.

Expressing troll opinions won't do any good and only invite people to post angry flames etc

Relax and play around with the nightly builds and you will see how far it has gone alredy,

be happy don't worry about M$

#16 Hey back.

by OLEVariant

Wednesday May 5th, 1999 5:04 AM

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Bitching about Mozilla's failure?

I've read every post in this thread and no one has said that Mozilla failed, self included.

Although, your statement regarding 'Mozilla's failure' is a bit past tense don't ya think? :)

#17 Jesse Berst

by Frobozz

Wednesday May 5th, 1999 5:39 AM

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Jesse Berst is a grade 'A' moron (which is saying a lot since he is coming from ZDNET).

He takes the following tactic all the time: he'll subtly start hyping some underdog (whether it be Linux, Mozilla or whatever). Then he'll post a glowing report about it, all sweetness and light. Finally, he'll round it all off with a long scathing editorial saying that "sure this technology is nice, but Microsoft is already the standard so why bother? Get back in line and stop fussing with this non-Microsoft-sanctioned code."

If you watch him long enough, it becomes rather amusing. He does it all the time. Berst has NO credibility and NO clue, so just ignore him.

#18 Re: Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by Brandon Watkins <brandon@wave22.com>

Wednesday May 5th, 1999 6:02 AM

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New here, but I certainly have my opinion of Jesse Berst.... You know that one guy you have to support... You know, that one that loads every screen saver he stumbles across, every shareware program on the Net instantly makes his Windows 5 times easier to use, his Windows SysTray takes up over half his taskbar because he has so many memory-resident programs? The one whose PC you have to format and re-load every 3 weeks because he's hosed his installation once again (due blame to MS while we're on it)? That's Jesse Berst.

#19 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by janahan

Wednesday May 5th, 1999 9:16 AM

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To OLEVariant:

I wasn't calling YOU a troll... I was calling Jesse Berst a Troll...

#20 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by Aleks Zawisza <awz@home.com>

Wednesday May 5th, 1999 11:03 AM

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If you read Anchordesk often, you probably noticed that every now and then, Jesse Berst says something like "I predicted this last year" and he puts a link to a story where he "predicted" this or that.

Well, the reason all his "predictions" come true is because he carefully manages to predict contradicting events.

He predicted the failure of Microsoft, and he predicted the success of Microsoft. He prediced that Mozilla will turn out great, and he's just predicted that it will fail. He's the kind of flip-flopping.

Of course if you do that you can later link to your particular side of a prediction and say "look, I said this would happen", and just forget about the time you took the opposite stance.

Don't worry, if he's posting anti-Mozilla opinions now, you can be *sure* that he will be posting pro-Mozilla stuff later.

He always does.

#21 Jesse Berst a.k.a. The Abortion

by -=Yusuf=- <ssym@hippo.ru.ac.za>

Wednesday May 5th, 1999 1:20 PM

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There was once a man named Berst, Who with M$ his opinions rehearsed, He's tried out some FUD, But we know it's just crud, And when the beta come out, he'll be praising it first.

Yes, a limerick .... to "honor" the man who we all know is more full of sh** than a bull with a sewn-up butt. I've seen this kind of crap from him before, and it doesn't impress me. Watch his columns when the beta comes out, he'll be the first to say "WOW what a great browser! I *knew* this would be a great product all the time!".

The best treatment for such as these is to ignore their puerile outbursts.....or spam their "talkback" boards with anti-Berst stuff, which is time-consuming but EVER so satisfying =)

-=Yusuf=-, handing Jesse the MS-Lackey-of-the-Year award.

PS Interesting he should mention that MS's legal troubles are just annoyances..... I wonder if he'll have the same opinion when it's split up....

#22 Re:Jesse Berst on Mozilla

by Adam Lock <locka@iol.ie>

Thursday May 6th, 1999 5:32 AM

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IHMO Jesse Berst is a windbag journalist whose opinions and predictions are laughably inaccurate to say the least.

I subscribed to the "Jesse Berst Anchordesk" for over a year and during that time I never read anything that I thought had any depth or insight. In fact to me his "informed opinion" was often little more than regurgitated press releases and marketing blurb.

Needless to say I've unsubscribed. What worries me though is that unknowledgable people will believe he speaks with authority and make bad and costly decisions as a result.