Full Article Attached Innovations from Athena Design and Mozilla

Monday April 5th, 1999

Several readers brought to our attention an interesting project being developed using the Mozilla code. Athena Design, located in San Francisco but with developers throughout the US, has developed an intriguing proof-of-concept for "Dynamic DOM Rewriting". What is DDR? Click "Full Article" below to read an interview we conducted with Athena Design's CTO, David Pollak.

If you feel that DDR is important, contribute to the conversation in the layout newsgroup. Read the article to find out more.

#20 Re:Still very Sad

by Basher

Thursday April 8th, 1999 6:41 PM

You are replying to this message

The best counter argument that you can come up with is that MS apps are under some metric "bloated"?

Netscape4.5 is no slim-chicken either, and IE5, without Netshow/ComicChat/Java/Windows Media Player/etc is < 10mb.

Office2000 may be large, but Office2000 offers more functionality than *any* other office package, and, in addition to supporting everyone else's file formats, it now supports saving as HTML/CSS/XML.

Nevertheless, face the facts: IE4 had CSS, XML, PICS, PNG, OSD, and Java1.1 (minus RMI and JNI) support way before Netscape did. It had dynamic styles and object model access too. It also had the coveted incremental layout that the Gecko engine is laying claim to.

And look at IE5: Support for XSL, Scripts, Behavioral Style Sheets, Voyager, Namespaces, etc. For instance, CSS behaviors are a good idea that should be copied. (Yes, Netscape has their own Action Style Sheets proposal, but it is semanatically identical with inferior syntax and way behind in deployment. Why not just support MS's? Too much Not-invented-here)

I am still a Netscape user, but I am sick of tired of people defending Netscape. They fucked up. Bad management, bad execution. They sat on a 3 year old decaying code base. They stopped innovating. They changed their focus from browser, to server, and then to application servers, and then finally to portals.

I really can't fault MS for developing a superior browser. It is patently obvious that IE4's rendering engine and object model support is superior to Netscape 4's.

Mozilla may be the answer, but all I'm saying is, you can't just IGNORE MS and say their code sucks and leave it at that. You have to be willing to admit that once in a while they have a good idea, and have the guts to copy it, just like they have copied everyone else.

Anything else is just irrational immature behavior.