MozillaZine

Nvu 0.2 Released

Thursday March 25th, 2004

The second major milestone release of Nvu, the Web publishing application based on Mozilla Composer, is now available for Linux and Windows. The main new feature in Nvu 0.2 is support for the creation, modification and utilisation of templates, preset pages that can include both editable and static elements. Version 0.2 also allows more CSS properties to be applied to pages and lets users to extract inline styles and make them into classes.

Based on Mozilla 1.7 Beta, Nvu 0.2 was developed by Daniel Glazman's Disruptive Innovations for Lindows.com. Further information about the new version, including release notes and download links, can be found at http://glazman.org/whyNvu/nvu.html.


#1 direction control

by tsahi

Thursday March 25th, 2004 12:37 PM

Reply to this message

i just hope daniel (or someone) will add a text directionality button one day, so we can write pages and html email in hebrew/arabic/other too one day. bug 96057.

#4 Re: direction control

by glazou <daniel@glazman.org>

Thursday March 25th, 2004 12:56 PM

Reply to this message

Shame on me. I promised to add it for 0.2 and I forgot. Templates kept me so busy... 0.3 for sure. Sorry for that.

#51 direction control

by tsahi

Sunday March 28th, 2004 1:52 AM

Reply to this message

when you do, will that go into the Mozilla Composer and Mail?

#2 PHP support?

by jedbro

Thursday March 25th, 2004 12:37 PM

Reply to this message

I remember Daniel talking about PHP support before. Anyone know if it made it into 0.2?

#3 Re: PHP support

by glazou <daniel@glazman.org>

Thursday March 25th, 2004 12:45 PM

Reply to this message

Oh! Thanks for the reminder jedbro: yes Nvu now preserves the PHP <? ... ?> pseudo-PI instructions. ASP-like format is not supported. Inserting PHP pseudo-PIs into the source view will work. Inserting them through the "Insert HTML" dialog will lead to trouble ;-) Hope that helps.

Daniel

#5 A little Problem

by uiucgrad

Thursday March 25th, 2004 1:00 PM

Reply to this message

It really looks great but I am having a little problem. When I click on the Edit Sites button I am not able to type into any of the Publish Settings fields unless I switch to another program and then switch back to Nvu. The only thing that is missing before my office could switch to this for general page editing is SFTP support. But great work.

-Ethan

#6 Problems...

by robdogg

Thursday March 25th, 2004 2:00 PM

Reply to this message

I am not sure whether these problems are scheduled to be addressed, but here it is:

1. When you click on the source tab on the bottom, all the tabs on the top disappear. 2. The editor converts entries to HTML escape codes. I do not want that. Example,line below:

<a href="{|OUTPUT_HREF|}&OutputTarget=excel" title="Export to Excel Format">

is converted to: <a href="%7B%7COUTPUT_HREF%7C%7D&amp;OutputTarget=excel" title="Export to Excel Format">

Thanks, but I put those values there for a reason, don't mess with it.

3. No line numbers. This is a must, since some browsers give you the error as a line number 4. No line wrap 5. What's the point of the chevron to the right of Nvu Site Manager, if you can't drag it anywhere 6. What's the point of the dropdown image to the left of Nvu Site Manager, if you can't drop it down 7. There is no Intellisense when writing code

Anyway, as it stands now, this tool is more of a HTML builder rather than a serious dev tool.

#7 Re: Problems...

by beastie

Thursday March 25th, 2004 2:42 PM

Reply to this message

> Anyway, as it stands now, this tool is more of a HTML builder rather than a serious dev tool.

Dude, it's only version 0.2.

#9 Re: Re: Problems...

by robdogg

Thursday March 25th, 2004 3:28 PM

Reply to this message

>Dude, it's only version 0.2.

Dude, it isn't a new product. It uses the mozilla editor code, version 1.7 by now.

#10 Re: Re: Re: Problems...

by jgraham

Thursday March 25th, 2004 3:33 PM

Reply to this message

Dude, it was never a serious priority for Netscape and it currenly has one developer contributing a substantial amount of time to the product. Dreamweaver wasn't built in a day, you know.

#13 Re: Re: Re: Re: Problems...

by robdogg

Thursday March 25th, 2004 5:11 PM

Reply to this message

>currenly has one developer contributing a substantial amount of time to the product. Dreamweaver wasn't built in a day, you know.

Totally, dude! I am not asking it to be Dreamweaver and I don't think it'll ever be that. I'll be happy when it is HomeSite.

#22 Whatever Dude

by Tanyel <tanyel@straightblack.com>

Friday March 26th, 2004 12:56 AM

Reply to this message

Dreamweaver MX 2004 has so many bugs, I still have to keep Dreamweaver MX installed for what MX 2004 will not do. If Nvu can do just those things with smaller memory and hard disk requirements than Dreamweaver MX, I may find it very useful even without it being as good as Dreamweaver.

#31 Re: Whatever Dude

by robdogg

Friday March 26th, 2004 10:33 AM

Reply to this message

Here is the main value of Dreamweaver (whichever version): You connect to the database, select a table/query/stored proc/whatever, then the app generates code for you (in ASP/ASP.NET/PHP/JSP/WhateverSP. I don't see NVU doing anything on that front. So far, it can be compared to FrontPage, but that's it.

To speak of it as a DreamWeaver replacement is about as poignant as talking about Notepad as Dreamweaver substitute.

#25 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Problems...

by jgraham

Friday March 26th, 2004 3:36 AM

Reply to this message

Dude, HomeSite is totally different, being a HTML optimised text-editor rather than a WYSIWYG environment*. HomeSite was also considered so good that Macromedia bought it to bundle with DreamWeaver.

*Of course, trying to be WYSIWIG when composing in a format that is supposed to be structural and cross-media doesn't make a lot of sense from a theoretical perspective. But, sadly, the public want a HTML editor that works just like MS Word.

#32 Re: Problems...

by robdogg

Friday March 26th, 2004 10:38 AM

Reply to this message

>>Dude, HomeSite is totally different, being a HTML optimised text-editor rather than a WYSIWYG environment*. HomeSite was also considered so good that Macromedia bought it to bundle with DreamWeaver.

You are correct. So, I was comparing the NVU's Source tab to HomeSite's Edit tab. So far, NVU's is more like Notepad in that respect.

#54 Re: Need help? Do it yourself

by lacostej <coffeebreaks@hotmail.com>

Sunday March 28th, 2004 6:05 PM

Reply to this message

> *Of course, trying to be WYSIWIG when composing in a format that is supposed to be structural and cross-media doesn't make a lot of sense from a theoretical perspective. But, sadly, the public want a HTML editor that works just like MS Word.

I disagree with the "sadly". Computing should be made to accomodate for the masses, make it easy for any user to use something wihout having to understand the inner working of some strange standards. Easy to use tools are lacaking and that's why even if computing has adanced a lot in the last years, we still have no email tools smart enough to warn a user when he is sending a 5M bmp image. How do you want my mother to use a computer when she is born in a time when having each book was so valuable that she didn't lost any of the ones she has in her choldhood? She should be able to send pictures to friends without wondering about the format. And she should be able to write an HTML page.

Even if it is hard to do, and even if it won't solve all people's problems, it doens't mean that it shouldn't be done. Thanks for Daniel for bringinh HTML to the masses in an open source way.

Daniel, if you read, next time I am in Paris if you're not busy, let me buy you a beer.

coffeebreaks

#11 Re: Re: Re: Problems...

by mlefevre

Thursday March 25th, 2004 3:34 PM

Reply to this message

Dude, the Mozilla editor code is just an HTML builder, not a serious dev tool. In terms of moving anywhere towards being a serious dev tool, it's a new product.

#14 Re: Re: Re: Re: Problems...

by robdogg

Thursday March 25th, 2004 5:17 PM

Reply to this message

>>In terms of moving anywhere towards being a serious dev tool, it's a new product.

That's the problem. It is not moving to be a dev tool, it is barely a HTML builder.

#18 Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Problems...

by jedbro

Thursday March 25th, 2004 8:44 PM

Reply to this message

>>"..... it is barely a HTML builder." Dude, that is what YOU think! :) I find it VERY functional dude. Still seems very alpha-ish, which it is, sure it's based off of 1.7 dude, but dude, most/all of the major and good features are BRAND new dude and need some time to mature.

I mean come on dude.

#33 Re: Problems...

by robdogg

Friday March 26th, 2004 10:40 AM

Reply to this message

>>Dude, that is what YOU think!

Actually, no, dude! My brain is connected to a water part surf generator.

#16 Re: Problems...

by thelem

Thursday March 25th, 2004 8:13 PM

Reply to this message

Dude, um

2. I'm trying to remember my HTML, but is <a href="{|OUTPUT_HREF|}&OutputTarget=excel"> valid HTML 4.0? I know that, by the HTML 4.01 spec, the ampersand needs to be encoded, even when it is in a quoted attribute value, is that true for the curley brackets and pipe as well? If so, then nvu is doing exactly the correct thing. If it did anything else, it would be outputing invalid HTML code.

7. Intellisense?

On an unrelated note, what is the ultimate goal of nvu? Is daniel/lindows planning to create a standalone HTML editor, part of the suite, HTML compose for mail or something else?

It would also be good if there were some screenshots. If noone creates any then I might get round to downloading it and making some ;)

#23 Re: Re: Problems...

by Tanyel <tanyel@straightblack.com>

Friday March 26th, 2004 12:58 AM

Reply to this message

So, maybe Nvu needs some way for people to specify when sections of their code are to be interpreted by a hypertext preprocessor rather than a web browser.

#28 Re: Re: Problems...

by WillyWonka

Friday March 26th, 2004 5:53 AM

Reply to this message

The screenshots weren't exactly hard to find... <http://www.nvu.com/features.html>

#34 Re: Re: Problems...

by robdogg

Friday March 26th, 2004 10:54 AM

Reply to this message

>>2. I'm trying to remember my HTML, but is <a href="{|OUTPUT_HREF|}&OutputTarget=excel"> valid HTML 4.0? I know that, by the HTML 4.01 spec, the ampersand needs to be encoded, even when it is in a quoted attribute value, is that true for the curley brackets and pipe as well? If so, then nvu is doing exactly the correct thing. If it did anything else, it would be outputing invalid HTML code. <<

That's fine and all. I process my HTML templates at the time of the HTTP request and replace my custom tags {|TAG_GOES_HERE|} with relevant data. This is standard and many software developers do it. NVU needs a setting that precludes it changing code. HomeSite does it, Quanta does it, FtontPage does, ...

>>Intellisense? On an unrelated note, what is the ultimate goal of nvu? Is daniel/lindows planning to create a standalone HTML editor, part of the suite, HTML compose for mail or something else? <<

I am not quite sure. He does not state the ultimate objective anywhere where I can see.

#46 Re: Re: Re: Problems...

by JanC

Saturday March 27th, 2004 2:16 PM

Reply to this message

"""That's fine and all. I process my HTML templates at the time of the HTTP request and replace my custom tags {|TAG_GOES_HERE|} with relevant data. This is standard and many software developers do it. NVU needs a setting that precludes it changing code. HomeSite does it, Quanta does it, FtontPage does, ..."""

You could also use a better-designed templating technology...

#48 Re: Re: Re: Re: Problems...

by robdogg

Saturday March 27th, 2004 6:37 PM

Reply to this message

>>You could also use a better-designed templating technology...

My templating technology is well-designed and battle tested by many web apps that are out there now. The technology (at least the initial attempt at) is described here: <http://www.vbrad.com/pf.a…/janmay01/art_aspless.htm>

#8 I just want to say this...!

by Zeron

Thursday March 25th, 2004 2:54 PM

Reply to this message

Daniel, you rock. Thanks for the hard work!

#12 Insert Table

by Tar

Thursday March 25th, 2004 4:38 PM

Reply to this message

One thing that I miss in Nvu from Microsoft FrontPage is its Insert Table feature, just click and hold on the Insert Table button, drag which shaped table you want and release:

<http://kodu.neti.ee/~tar/tmp/nvu/>

Shots taken with FrontPage 2000, that's ~5 years old now.

#15 Re: Insert Table

by polidobj

Thursday March 25th, 2004 6:55 PM

Reply to this message

I think the way Nvu does it is fine. I don't use to many tables anyway. Any table I'd need would probably come from something like a spreadsheet or database which copying and pasting would result in a table automatically. I'd hate to have to fill that big table in the last pic manually. Just because it's five years old doesn't make it superior.

#45 Re: Re: Insert Table

by coldacid <coldacid@gmail.com>

Saturday March 27th, 2004 12:42 PM

Reply to this message

I deal with tables a lot, since I'm not great enough with CSS to position and size everything properly. (I'm a coder, not a web designer.) Tables are still used a lot since they'll also work on older browsers (although, WhyTF do we still have to support them? and why do all the editors still just do HTML 4?) and are pretty easy to manage in terms of size (of the tables themselves and of the cells within).

Just because it's not superior doesn't mean it isn't useful.

#47 Re: Re: Re: Insert Table

by WillyWonka

Saturday March 27th, 2004 2:53 PM

Reply to this message

"why do all the editors still just do HTML 4?"

Two letters. I E

#50 Re: Re: Re: Insert Table

by Waldo_2

Saturday March 27th, 2004 10:29 PM

Reply to this message

Just HTML4? As opposed to what? XHTML 1.0 == HTML 4 Strict, and XHTML 1.1 is very nearly the same as XHTML 1.0. There's really not much practical difference between HTML4 and anything newer that's actually an official W3C recommendation (or whatever they call it - just not draft & whatever XHTML2 is).

#17 Re: Insert Table

by thelem

Thursday March 25th, 2004 8:15 PM

Reply to this message

Actually, thats from Word 97, if not before, so that makes it 8 years old now. And yes, it is an easy way to create tables.

BTW, I forgot: Daniel & Lindows/Lin----: Nice work.

#20 Re: Insert Table

by Tar

Thursday March 25th, 2004 10:20 PM

Reply to this message

Right, Word 97 had it too IIRC. It should be also available with free FrontPage Express that came with IE 5.

Also Draw Table and Eraser tools are quite handy for fiddling with complex tables, otherwise figuring out rowspan/colspan would melt my brain :P

See here:

<http://kodu.neti.ee/~tar/tmp/nvu/edit1.png>

<http://kodu.neti.ee/~tar/tmp/nvu/edit2.png>

<http://kodu.neti.ee/~tar/tmp/nvu/edit3.png>

<http://kodu.neti.ee/~tar/tmp/nvu/edit4.png>

<http://kodu.neti.ee/~tar/tmp/nvu/edit5.png>

<http://kodu.neti.ee/~tar/tmp/nvu/edit6.png>

<http://kodu.neti.ee/~tar/tmp/nvu/edit7.png>

Oh, and I love the widgets that come ontop table cells in Composer/Nvu, just that they should use right cursor on them:

<http://kodu.neti.ee/~tar/tmp/nvu/quickmod.png>

Just giving devs some ideas, not complaining ;)

#29 Re: Re: Insert Table

by WillyWonka

Friday March 26th, 2004 5:54 AM

Reply to this message

Word 95 had it too.

#36 Re: Re: Re: Insert Table

by jdakula

Friday March 26th, 2004 1:45 PM

Reply to this message

Which means that Word 6.0 had it, since word 95 was just the 32-bit version of the Windows 3.1 Word.

#19 Edit in Nvu extension for Firefox?

by Kohath

Thursday March 25th, 2004 9:45 PM

Reply to this message

Can someone write an "Edit in Nvu" extension for Firefox?

I'd do it myself, but... Well, if I was really going to do it myself, I wouldn't be asking, would I?

#37 Re: Edit in Nvu extension for Firefox?

by buff

Friday March 26th, 2004 5:13 PM

Reply to this message

How about an edit in Mozedit feature. You can get it here: <http://mozedit.mozdev.org/> I need to update it for Firefox and add foreign language support. An update will be ready in about a month. -Mark

#44 Better yet...

by coldacid <coldacid@gmail.com>

Saturday March 27th, 2004 12:37 PM

Reply to this message

Why not something more like the edit button in (don't shoot me) IE? It at least lets you choose from a drop-down which editor to use. The hardest part would be actually getting the editor to run and open the file.

So far, however, I can't seem to get Nvu to open files from the command line or the Run... dialog box. Hell, if there's a way to get Nvu to open a document on startup, I haven't seen it. I'd love to know, though.

#21 Are there plans of backporting Nvu to Mozilla suit

by BigSerpent

Thursday March 25th, 2004 11:14 PM

Reply to this message

Mozilla includes HTML editor and the Nvu is based on it. Will it be backported into Mozilla?

#27 Re: Are there plans of backporting Nvu to Mozilla

by jsebrech

Friday March 26th, 2004 5:46 AM

Reply to this message

Nvu uses the new front-end from firefox if I'm not mistaken, so it might be problematic backporting to mozilla, the suite. I suppose it'll become a component of the loose apps.

#43 Re: Re: Are there plans of backporting Nvu to Mozilla

by coldacid <coldacid@gmail.com>

Saturday March 27th, 2004 12:34 PM

Reply to this message

Pretty much all that would break on Mozilla itself, as far as I can discern, is the front-end. Anything back-endian (br tag killage, PI saving, etc.) should be able to be brought back in, if that hasn't already been done.

#24 Haven't tried it, but...

by leafdigital

Friday March 26th, 2004 2:40 AM

Reply to this message

...I just want to say thanks to daniel and the Lindows people for developing this editor. I work at a university (the Open University in the UK, a distance-learning institution) and we have several courses in which students are expected to develop their own web sites.

Currently we ship Netscape 7.x (DON'T ask me why that isn't Mozilla 1.6, given that the NS product is discontinued, contains known security holes, has no advantages and is more likely to mess up student machines by installing crap) and use Composer in that.

Every so often academics ask me, 'hey composer isn't very good, it doesn't do x y and z, is there anything better...?' -and after I've finished telling them they should get the university to ship Mozilla instead of Netscape because at least it's a bit newer, I tell them, 'well, I don't know, you tell me, check out the alternatives' (this being FREE alternatives, obviously, and they have to be ultra-easy to use because we don't want to make life difficult for our students, while also producing decent HTML). Then they go check out the alternatives and come back to me crying because all the alternatives are *worse*. :)

Nvu looks like a great project to basically take Composer (which is IMO decent but limited) and add more power. So recently when people ask me that question I've been saying - 'not yet but take a look at this new product called Nvu, it's based on Composer but a bit more powerful, you might want to keep an eye on that for when it is released...'

Anyway basically the responses on this thread looked sort of somewhat negative (not saying ALL of them were at all, but just on balance) so I just wanted to say - yes there is a need for a free easy-to-use editor that is a bit more powerful than Mozilla Composer, and yes Nvu looks like it's going in the right direction, and yes I'm glad somebody is putting in the work (and lindows putting in the funding) to make it happen.

So I read the information about each update with interest. Thanks; and I look forward to the finished result. :)

--sam

#26 wow

by wvw

Friday March 26th, 2004 4:20 AM

Reply to this message

Congratulations! Seems like after Firefox and Thunderbird, this could develop into winner number three. Thanks!

#42 What about Sunbird?

by coldacid <coldacid@gmail.com>

Saturday March 27th, 2004 12:32 PM

Reply to this message

Certainly, a lot more needs to be done on it, but same with Nvu! I think you broke my heart. :)

#30 Works for me

by jsebrech

Friday March 26th, 2004 6:01 AM

Reply to this message

A shout-out from someone who likes nvu.

I've been using nvu 0.17 to write html documentation for a project I'm working on, and it's been working fine. There is some general quirkiness in the wysiwyg view. When using divs it can be painful to get your cursor into the right div (please make it so clicking to the right of something places the cursor at the end of that something), and the previous version's lack of dt/dd support was also annoying (but 0.2 fixed that I think).

It's a good tool for when you need to quickly whip up a html page that looks decent and has reasonably ok code.

It's not a good tool for advanced website design, using preprocessors and extremely complicated layouts, but that's not what it was meant for. It's for the people who don't design websites for a living and just want to make a html page without having to read three books to figure out how. I'm sure for that kind of person it's a great program. Not that I design websites for a living, but I have read my way through o'reilly's definitive guides on html and css.

If I really need something nvu doesn't do, I'll open up quanta and do it there. But, you know, sometimes I just want to get content on the page. Nvu works great for that.

#35 nice progress

by jilles

Friday March 26th, 2004 11:51 AM

Reply to this message

I commented on 0.1 too and complained about the lack of templates :-). Things are progressing well even though it's not really working well. I could create a template, and an instance. But I found no obvious way to propagate changes in the template to the instance.

I don't like the way editable regions are marked (divs/spans instead of custom comment tags such as dreamweaver). A potential problem is that validators will complain about the custom attribute. In addition it has a few limitations.

Dreamweaver is a bit more flexible: 1) it has nested templates, should be fixable in nvu. 2) you can mark parts of the head editable (great for linking additional css/javascript and adding meta tags). You can't do that with divs or spans. 3) you get a dialog that allows you to 'apply' the template changes to its instances when you save changes in a template (this requires keeping track of all the instances in the sitemanager, I can imagine this functionality is still under development).

I'll be interested in further development and I will give 0.3 a spin.

#38 Nvu

by aldo_ <mozilla@martinalderson.co.uk>

Saturday March 27th, 2004 7:51 AM

Reply to this message

I tried Nvu out today, but I'm finding it completely lacking for anything more than very, very quick pages.

It's WAY too dialog-ized.. everywhere you go there is another dialog. I think more pallets like the FTP site one would improve the fluidness of using the application.

I have a few more general solutions:

- Better icons - Easier to define font lists (ie, when you hit the font dropdown you should have font lists, eg: Tahoma, Verdana, Arial, Sans Serif, then another option to view all fonts. The font lists should be easily changeable). - Syntax highlighting in HTML. I'm confused why it's not there - Firefox has it so it must be in gecko somewhere. Then expand the highlighting to CSS and PHP, and maybe even more such as ASP and JSP. - Better use of CSS. For example, use the font size up tool. It produces horrible code. However, I'm sure these issues will be dealt with soon.

Also, a developers site should be a top priority, IMO.

Overall a nice tool - it has the workings to become a dreamweaver-standard app, if more people were working on it and more time is allowed. Personally, I feel this could become a gem of the open source world, but I think it will be 1.0 before it's going to be usable for anything other than quick hacks.

#41 Developer Site

by coldacid <coldacid@gmail.com>

Saturday March 27th, 2004 12:30 PM

Reply to this message

I agree, the sooner that the developer site is up and running, the better.

#39 Sample templates and tips?

by alongton

Saturday March 27th, 2004 8:16 AM

Reply to this message

Can anything be a sample template (with the special markup) or do templates have to be created from scratch? (Just starting to fiddle with this.)

#40 FP-like "web" management?

by coldacid <coldacid@gmail.com>

Saturday March 27th, 2004 12:29 PM

Reply to this message

The only thing keeping me from switching right over now to Nvu is the navigation/"web" management feature of FrontPage. I've figured out some way to hold a navigation tree like FP has for webs, but there's the issue of actually having the in-page menus generated from it. I'm not really expecting anything like this until at least 0.9 (or even 1.9), and since I can manage by hand it isn't too critical, but it is time-consuming and I love how I can get FP to do it all for me.

Perhaps I could be dropped a line about what (little) I've done.

#52 about fp web trees

by smkatz

Sunday March 28th, 2004 7:39 AM

Reply to this message

If you are talking about the concept of a web view where all the pages are shown and how they are linked to one another, hypothetically, this can be supported.

It goes into the realm of project manager, however, so.. it goes back to the intent of NVU.

If you are talking about the navigation that the Frontpage server automatically does for you.. NVU will probably never support interaction or modification to those elements.. however, they should continue to work. (ie. in the final release of NVU, or even now, I don't know), NVU shouldn't touch any "bot" comments in the code.

What host do you use? You can write me at <mozillazine2103@paperlessconscience.com>. --Sam

#53 Re: about fp web trees

by coldacid <coldacid@gmail.com>

Sunday March 28th, 2004 2:56 PM

Reply to this message

I mean, like how FP does those site navigation menus automagically based on the site tree managed in its Navigation view. Anyway, FP doesn't just put in some bot tags, it also generates the menus itself in the page. Nvu could at least do that, even if there's no server-side crud. And same with image galleries.

#49 What about MacOS X?????

by pkb351 <pbergsagel@shaw.ca>

Saturday March 27th, 2004 6:40 PM

Reply to this message

Any chance to have a port OS X??

If not this is a real shame. Maybe Apple would be interested in a new "i" app called iWebSight. Any chance interesting someone from Apple to help out and thus get a MacOS X port?

#55 WebDAV

by olivergeorge

Saturday April 3rd, 2004 7:30 PM

Reply to this message

I'm often frustrated that Contribute & Dreamweaver have a feature missing... WebDAV support. NVU could differentiate itself by getting that in early. Mozilla supports WebDAV so perhaps it's not too difficult. All of this you've probably thought about, any idea when WebDAV support is likely to arrive?