Reports on Phoenix/Minotaur Renaming Focus on Firebird Database Protest

Wednesday April 16th, 2003

InternetNews was one of the first sites to report on the renaming of Phoenix and Minotaur to Firebird and Thunderbird. Australian site LinuxWorld concentrated on the reaction from the Firebird database community, with claims that posts in "the Netscape-Mozilla newsgroup" (it's unclear exactly which newsgroup this refers to) are being censored. CNET also focussed on the controversy, including a link to a page from FirebirdSQL Foundation sponsor IBPhoenix that encourages people to join the "fray" and add to the "heat in [the MozillaZine] forums". The call-to-arms also lists the email addresses of many of the more prominent Mozilla contributors and suggests deluging them with messages (even though many of the listed people had nothing to do with the name change).

Posts to the forums about the name change should be kept polite and constructive and added to the existing name change announcement topic.

Update! The Firebird Admins have posted a statement about Phoenix's renaming to Firebird on their front page. Stating that they "strongly oppose this change", the announcement follows the earlier IBPhoenix article in asking its readers to declare their objections by posting to Mozilla community forums and emailing various Mozilla developers.

#221 Re: Re: Re: Market Confusion?

by airporttools

Saturday April 19th, 2003 11:43 PM

You are replying to this message

> The problem with your comparison is that you are assuming that Mozilla Firebird is going to be listed as Firebird in the Add/Install application listing.

Well, that might be stretching it. But, it's never good to have two variations of the same thing, in this case a name, that somebody will need to choose between.

You really have to think in terms of computer literate people who want to get things done as quickly as possible, with as little thought involved as possible. They are not thinking in terms of "Am I deleting the right thing?" Their, thinking, "Ah, Firebird, that's it, poof, it's gone."

> Firebird browser can appear listed as Mozilla Firebird and the other can be listed as Firebird DB

That's great, but who is going to go back and fix all of those installations that I already have out there? They exist and are already in usage. I'm sure my story could be repeated often by others.

If you're voluteering then I'd love to hear from you.

> Will regular endusers of Firebird DB be installing and unistalling your database.

Absolutely. Already been done. The clients are usually civil engineering types. Smart, usually somewhat computer literate, often working in a consulting type environment.

The engineering consulting type environments in this case often are "offices" of much larger organizations. Thus, the offices may only be twenty or thirty people. Often these offices are just big enough for maybe one sysadmin, sometimes not.

But, since the product is usually used by only one or two people in the office there is no need for a backend db server situation, so the DB gets installed on one or two machines maximum. The direct user's machine in this case. And most times the end-user installs it. I've seen it done hundreds of times.

Also, the usage is project oriented, not strictly form/record oriented, so it is difficult for multiple people to actually work on the same data simultaneously and the result make any sense when done.

> Last time I check you downloadable Firebird DB did not even have an installer.

Oh, Firebird has a very nice installer, at least on Windows. I haven't had time to try the Linux version yet, but I do have people asking for it!

> (to me Firebird DB has "geek" written all over it)

I believe you are being a tad bit narrow minded in this case. That is not meant as a derogatory statement! I actually sorta agree with you.

Personally, to me, anything beyond a hand maintained spreadsheet database of material has geek written all over it. Think about it. If you even have an inkling of an idea what a relational database is then you're pretty darn geeky.

But, if you need a relational DB that can handle 400 tables and 3000 triggers with ease then you usually start thinking big, Oracle type big.

Firebird can handle it. I cannot attest to it's speed, that's beyond me. But, it's certainly perfect for the case where Access type DBs are small potatoes, MySQL type DBs don't have the feature set, and Oracle type DBs could cost a bundle.

And if you need it easily deployed and used then definitely Firebird is the way to go.

I know this is probably a mistake (there goes my website's bandwidth for the month), but if you would like to try Firebird as used in my app on Windows, go to <>.

Download the beta app, please be kind, it needs lots of work, has no direct usage documentation yet (tons of indirect docs though) and it's just two of us working on it. But, it is functional for those in the know.