M13 Out!Wednesday January 26th, 2000M13 builds have started appearing on the ftp site. Windows, Mac and Linux builds so far, more sure to come. Fullcircle builds are also available, which will pass crash data back to the developers. The release notes are now out. There are lots of links to ways you can get involved with Mozilla, so check it out. UPDATE! We have updated the builds page here at MZ to include the M13 builds... and the M12 builds... and the M11 builds... :) Subj... I asked in #mozilla if it was alpha or not and I got 3 people saying "ugh" so I think thats a no. Maybe thay are planning on skipping the alpha and going straight to the beta or something. http://www.mozilla.org/ it sez right there that M13 is Alpha http://www.mozilla.org/projects/seamonkey/milestones/index.html also tells us that M13 is alpha any questions? :) Yes! M13 release and XHTML Rec on the same day! http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/ I hope another FreeBSD build will show up this time. And is the DOM viewer working again? I haven't seen it working in a while... I am pulling the M13 branch right this very moment. I should have a binary package ready sometime tomorrow. pete M13 is really very much more stable now (slashdot loads :) - moving more of my browsing across to mozilla now. Thanks for the good work ! Just curious, how much of your browsering/mail/news do you use Mozilla for now (for those of you who regular download and use the builds). For me, it's 99% of my browsing, I have rarely the need to launch Communicator except downloading a new build or shop online. 1% of my mail, I'm still experimenting with this. 0% of my news, I have yet to figure out why it won't work for me. Well looking forward to another exciting Milestone! <:3)~~ 30% of my browsing, maybe a bit less, this would increase if the mail client worked for me, but I think it's just the experimental builds I've been trying, we'll see about M13 0% of my mail 0% news I dload a Nightly Build for Linux almost every night (which on 28.8 is a *bit* of a pain... ^_^). Anyway: - 95% of browsing (I go back to NC 4.71 when one of the Nightly Builds segfaults at least four times during one of my sessions) - 0% of mail (but I want to! I just can't get it to accept my settings once I enter them in the Wizard!) - 0% of news (don't read much news... ^_^) It's a stellar product so far. I was just advocating Mozilla today to a friend of mine on the bus home. I still can't believe the functionality it has, for being a pre-alpha product. Oh yeah, I haven't used the Editor at all, as I've heard nothing on how good it is. I'm lazy, so I use Composer 4.71, but I'd like to start using the Editor, so I can make 100% compliant pages... I tried the editor today. It worked but it did not make use of relative paths, and I could not change the image properties by right-clicking. There were no unnecessary tags, which I appreciated. I have not experimented with the editor enough to determine how good it is but I think the old Composer is better right now. I use it every once and a while, maybe as much as 20% of the time I'm composing pages. Save often. It has a long way to go to be as slick as 4.x but it is getting there. 4. table editing was sooo much nicer bu one day Mozilla will catch up. Again, save often if you're doing anything big. -Asa (posted witn mozilla) I use Mozilla for all my browsing except hotmail because Mozilla won't let me login to my hotmail account. I don't use it for email because I use hotmail for email. I don't use it for news either although I will as soon as Mozilla will let me set up a news account without it crashing. Is this still a problem. If it is can you file a bug? The only bug I see related to hotmail is http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=18258 and that shouldn't keep anyone from accessing hot mail According to the M13 release notes mozilla still can't load all secure sites. I think hotmail is just one of the ones it can't. My Browsing goes: >65% Moz 30% NS 4.7 <5% IE 5 Mail I am using Moz for, and I am using it for news too (seems to work OK for me) Using a M14 Nightly. I'm not going back to milestones. You can't make me. ;) < 5% of browsing 0% email 0% news I'm doing work in an SSL environment all day every day. Now that export restrictions have been relaxed, i would like to SSL capable builds start appearing. If so, i would start using as my standard browser. I just decided to make M13 my default browser from now on, so expect some bug reports from me :-). Its stable in Win 32 (98 & 2000)and its now faster and have not crashed on me. You must have a tremendous amount of RAM memory if you think it is fast in Windows 98. There are some times when Mozilla feels sluggish, but I am using it for 99% of my browsing is because it's more stable than both Netscape and IE on my computer. It's probably my computer but as long as Mozilla works I'll keep on using it and submit bug reports :) <:3)~~ I run win32 mozilla regularly on a P100 with 16 MB of RAM. I also run it on a P90 with 32 MB RAM and a PII350 with 64 MB RAM. It is pretty slow on the P100 and very usable on the P90. It is more than just _usable_ on the PII350, it moves really quick. -Asa (posted painlessly with mozilla on a P90 with 32MB RAM) 99% browser (Nav4 is useful for realaudio and bugs verification) but i must admit this : 0.5% mail 0.5% news i'm not too proud of it as a Mozilla tester... but as a Linux user once you have learned to use such tools as mutt (mail) or slrn (news), you can't help using them. they're so efficient. I browse with mozilla 90% of the time at work and about 60% of the time at home. I read and compose mail and news exclusively with mozilla. I have been using mozilla composer about 20% of the time and Netsape composer 80% of the time. Asa (posted with mozilla for sure) Right now Moz is about 80% of my browsing, 50% mail an 0% news You can have the choice not to install Mail and News. If you run the install, you can select custom and remove it. But you still have to download it in one package for now. The 3 different versions of the windows builds differ by about 1 meg. I understand why the talkback build it bigger, but why is the installer build much smaller? #18 Re: Why the size difference between Windows buildsby Kaoslord Wednesday January 26th, 2000 7:54 PM the installer builds have compression as those wizardy installer programs have pretty good compression schemes. I know this is the case for the regular builds, and not sure about the milestones, but the compressed builds contain some extra test programs that take up space. They eliminated much of this for the install build. <:3)~~ Its because the zip and talkback versions include all the files used for debugging. The install version has all of those files removed. Thats why its smaller. I would like a list of the test files so I can delete them. It's easy, they are basically all the EXE files with the word "test" in their name. I am not sure if other files with "test" in their name are also one of them but I know its safe to delete the EXE ones. You can also download both the ZIP and the installer builds and compare them to see what files are missing. <:3)~~ just browsing through the nightlies... check this out. ftp://ftp.mozilla.org/pub/mozilla/nightly/experimental/debug/ someone want to try this? it's 8.5MB, entitled "seamonkey-win32d.zip" It is a debug build. It is built with the debug code turned on (hense the size difference). just a guess, Asa (posted with mozilla) Hi, Just wondering what the difference is between: mozilla-win32-M13.zip and mozilla-win32-installer-M13.exe? Yeah I guess the latter actually installs from an installer but then why is the file size smaller? (4845Kb compared to 5674Kb) Are there any components missing? I remember that initially the version that included fullcircle didn't include some components or something but I assume this isn't the case anymore (as the filesize is now larger than the others). Just thought I'd see if anyone knew anything. #29 Re: Can someone explain the different Win32 buildsby gerbilpower Wednesday January 26th, 2000 9:05 PM There is no difference between the two builds, it's just that the ZIP version contain some test programs, while the installer build is stripped of those programs. <:3)~~ Password-authenticated news is not fully implimented yet, so if you need a password to access your news server, it might not work. You can follow the progress of this bug at <http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12924> sorry, I didn't realize how mozillazine does links. Try this: http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=12924 ------- Additional Comments From leger@netscape.com 2000-01-26 15:31 ------- Please Add for http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=19314: "Using AOL as your internet access and running Mozilla build at the same time may have problems for AOL 4.0 and earlier versions . No problems have been found using AOL 5.0 and Mozilla simultaneously however." Ha! How many AOL users are going to be downloading pre-beta software and running it? I jeft...oh well, now that AOL owns Netscape I suspect this is the reasoning. Pre-AOL Netscape wouldn't have cared a lick about AOL.. I use AOL and I downloaded Mozilla... so I guess the answer is "one". When I log on to the Mozilla.org FTP server, all I seem to get is README and Welcome.msg, with no other folders. The link in the article doesn't work either. Is this just because the Mozilla FTP server is busy? Hmmph... works now that I opened IE :( but it still doesn't work with Netscape... I tried accessing a FTP server and all it gave me was a blank page. A similar thing if I have a broken link and I open in a new window... I just get a blank page. So I take it FTP is busted in M13... oh well, there is always M14 :) Ran the Mozilla app. Seamonkey release notes are the homepage. Clicked to minimize the sidebar. Proceeded to crash HARD. Runs worse than M13 nightly builds. Oh well - just have to wait for M14. Try an M14 build, I downloaded one a couple of days ago and it worked well. They even have fixed the migrating of profiles from 4.x to 5, so you can use the MozillaInstaller program. win98, and opening and closing sidebar crashes mozilla. already submitted it as a bug. m14? where?
The Milestone Releases are not the only available builds. Every day (almost) there are builds pushed for win32, mac and linux to the /nightly directory on the mozilla FTP server. There builds are the cutting edge and therefor often are not as stable as the releases. But if you want to use the latest mozilla available check out a nightly. There has been almost a weeks worth of developoment on the path to M14. These are referred to as M14 nightlies. Asa (posted with mozilla) http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23709 must be destroyed. This has killed all chance of me using Mozilla productively for the past three weeks to a month. I've voted for this bug and am planning on getting the fullcircle version just to show the QA dudes that "works for me" is never good. Fight for this bug. I'm sure there's other dudes who crash necko.dll at many inorportune moments. (all the time) Will someone please tell me how to get things like flash, realplayer and java working in mozilla? That's pretty much the last barrier to me using mozilla almost exclusively. Thanks :) Will someone please tell me how to get things like flash, realplayer and java working in mozilla? That's pretty much the last barrier to me using mozilla almost exclusively. Thanks :) Assuming you are on win32, copy your Nav4 plugin folder to mozilla's bin folder. Note: I mean the folder itself not its contents only! basic I am unable to use mozilla at work since I have to supply a login and password for the proxy and mozilla is not recognizing the request from the proxy server I have the same problem. Is there a work around? Can I do something locally, or do I have to ask the proxy administrator do something? Help! Fred K. Cebu City, Philippines You'll have to talk to the Proxy Admin... my guess is that they have MS Proxy Server 2.0 and have it configured for NTLM (NT Challange/Responce) authentication. This is only supported in IE. See http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=23679 for information about this being added. You can also ask your admin to change this to basic/clear text or no authentication (not likely). If my estimation of the situation is wrong, you should get the particulars of your situation and submit a bug report. Good work on M14. The last version I'd gotten to work on NT was around M7 or M8. Nice interface, great speed. One thing, though: the scrollbars in News and Mail feel weird. The thumb is really large even though it only shows a small portion of the message headers. Dave Hyatt checked in a fix a few days ago. The problem was specific to trees. All trees in mozilla had scrollbars that did not have properly resizing thumbs. Now they work/look/feel right. Asa (posted with mozilla) Any one here use yahoo mail? I was able to connect to my yahoo and do everything I needed with M9-M12, but M13 and the early M14 builds seem to have a problem trying to connect. M13 seems to no be able to get passed the yahoo mail login screen, and M14 will consistently give "mail.yahoo.com host not found". Anyone else have these problems? Try entering the first letter of your password twice. eg If your password is "foobar" try ffoobar and see if that works. That's really odd, I've been able to use Mozilla to access my YahooMail with no problems for months. Even "Check All" works now! <:3)~~ as I said... it had been working for me up until M13. I guess I'll have to use Nescape 4.7 for yahoo mail for now and wait to try an M14 build later. *sigh* BTW... I should mention this only happens to me on the Winblows version. I just tried the Linux version and it seems to work just fine. I tried M13 on Mandrake Linux 7.0 (Pent. II 333MHz, 128 MB ram) on the test files provided and could not get any of them to work. 95 and up for processor and 19M and up for memory. Hey, although m13 is very fast and stable, I can't use it for my daily browsing. I mostly chat and m13 is not able to load any chat pages. I just get a message, that there's no connection to the server and that I should hit reload. Try it out at www.chatcity.de Then it still doesn't load some pages, maybe because of weired java-scripts. and it has probs with cgi-scripts. Is it that wretched bug 1582? Wretched, wretched bug. Kill it! Kill it! Oh how I wish I had more than 5 votes. I tried M13 on Mandrake Linux 7.0 (Pent. II 333MHz, 128 MB ram) on the test files provided and could not get any of them to work. 95 and up for processor and 19M and up for memory. I have a K6-2 450 and a Celeron 300A with 256 and 64MB RAM respectively. Both run M13 and the daily builds without any problems, perhaps there is something wrong with your system? Mozilla is taking approx 24MB over four processes, Netscape has two processes, one registering 16MB, the other 30MB. I just installed M13, and noticed a few things that made me pause: - It tried to install to a 'Netscape' subdirectory' - It had AOL Instant Messenger preinstalled as a Helper Application - It had a netscape.com website in the wallet setup. If these occurred as the result of migrating my 4.x profile, it's not a big deal, but they shouldn't (IMHO) come in by default...Mozilla is supposed to be officially independant of Netscape, is it not? AIM is what particularly concerned me; I dislike it, and don't want to see a bunch of ties to it in Mozilla the way there are in Navigator. Are you sure you downloaded the right program? <:3)~~ Yep..."mozilla-win32-installer-M13.exe". Running it, the default install directory is "C:\Program Files\Netscape\Seamonkey". It seems to me that this should be "C:\Program Files\Mozilla\Seamonkey". After install, go to Preferences->Applications, and see AIM there. Then go to Preferences->Wallet and see the default wallet table is at: http://people.netscape.com/morse/wallet/tables/ As I said, some of this might have migrated from my 4.7 settings...if so, I'm not too worried about it. Is anyone else seeing this? I tried the installer once, that was over a month ago. And it's suppose to install in that directory, so don't worry about it as long as it doesn't install over your current version of Netscape. Oh, I thought that you said that Mozilla CAME with AIM. It just probably found AIM on your computer, and that's it. <:3)~~ It's probably because most of the contributors work for Netscape and will be used to the Netscape name. The first few installer builds did refer to the product as Netscape Seamonkey then they renamed it to Mozilla Seamonkey but the old directory names still remained. As for the AIM listed in the helper applications, the helper applications part of the preferences is not hooked up yet and AOL Instant messenger is just there as a placeholder. As for the wallet table. That's hosted on people.netscape.com this is not an official Netscape site, it's the Netscape employees site, so it's just someone who works for Netscape is hosting the wallet tables on their personal webspace. That's good to hear. If Mozilla is going to ship with a default location for wallet tables, perhaps a place should be made for them on Mozilla.org? Or is there some kind of intellectual property issue involved? I also really think that the default install directory should be under Mozilla, not Netscape, legacy issues notwithstanding...the image of Mozilla's independence is important to maintain. I would love to try M13 out but, for what I do Java is essential. What do I need to do? I copied the Plugins from my NS4 directory and that make JavaScript work, but no Java. I'm using Windows 98. You don't need to do anything to get moment you launch Mozilla for the first time. Java requires a plugin, but the Java 1.3 plugin is still in development and some of the pre-releases have had problems when using them with Mozilla. <:3)~~ When I click the hide side bar blue vertical bar, the side bar hides. However when I press it again, the side bar won't come back out!? Is this confirmed? Godric Are you talking about M13? Or the nightly builds? I'm not seeing it in M13 fullcircle build (win32). Which platform are you on? Anyway the bug number for it is 14685 http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=14685 I'm downloading the nightly build tonight. Will check if it shows up there. You mean that it comes out partly, looking like some weird overlap? I believe that is a confirmed issue that shows up occasionally. Currently, there are a bunch of bugs with the side panel. My Mozilla on NT is running flawlessly. Seems has attained the stability of NC47, but a bit higher CPU utilization than NC. However Mozilla on 95 crashes very often, much worse than M12, I duno why. Reinstallation won't help. :( Perhaps there is some conflicts with...?? Mail and News no luck, crashes often. I love Mozilla very much. Although it's just the alpha, great success!! Keep it on!! Anyone having any luck with the Sparc Linux build? I managed to build M12 from an SRPM and that worked O.K., but source buids of everything else, and the new M13 build, segfault on me every time. Does this one work for anyone else? I use Moz at work quite a bit, since it's more stable than IE or NS on my particular machine (Win95). Not so much of an advantage at home, on Linux. Keyboard still doesn't work in the browser though. It's a pain having to use the mouse to scroll a page. I am used to tabbing around and scrolling with the keyboard in Moz. I didn't know you couldn't do it! Hey people, just thought I'd let you know that I've been using M13 for three days straight now without a crash (though I haven't tried Mail and News yet). This is on a P200 32Mb Win95 box which has been doing some very screwy things lately :) I'm now going to play around with all the extra bits ... see if I can get it to crash :) It has not crashed at all since I downloaded it. Is it supposed to take 40 seconds to load a webpage? No, it's not supposed to take that long. looked at the debug window to see if there's a problem? The debug window was utterly useless except to tell the length of time it took for the page to load. Thing is, sometimes when a page has been loading for a while I check the debug window and see error loading page :P (and when the throbber disappears I know to restart Moz) Really? I have never seen the throbber disappear. I have seen the debug window say the page took 78.01 seconds to load. The console window isn't realy a debug window. It is an output of a few printfs that can help watching certain things. These items are turned on and off daily and generally aren't very useful to anyone except the particular developer that included them. But most or all of the actual debug code is turned off for the nightly and release builds. A debug build is about 30% larger than a nightly and I hope to see them available at ftp.mozilla.org soon. I don't think that mozilla.org needs to post one nightly but maybe once a week or every two weeks (at bare minimum, it would be nice to have a debug build available with each milestone.) Alan has found a nice shareware tool for debug output and I think that those of us who don't have strong enough machines to build ourselves (me, a P100 with 16MB RAM would take all day) would be willing to run these larger/slower builds when it would help the bug fixing process. Asa On SuSE Linux 6.3: jimbo@raptus:/usr/home/jimbo/mozilla > ./mozilla .//run-mozilla.sh ./mozilla-bin MOZILLA_FIVE_HOME=/usr/home/jimbo/mozilla LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/home/jimbo/mozilla SHLIB_PATH=/usr/home/jimbo/mozilla LIBPATH=/usr/home/jimbo/mozilla MOZ_PROGRAM=./mozilla-bin MOZ_TOOLKIT= moz_debug=0 moz_debugger= ************************************************** nsNativeComponentLoader: SelfRegisterDll(/usr/home/jimbo/mozilla/components/libnsjpg.so) Load FAILED with error: libjpeg.so.62: cannot open shared object file: No such file or directory ************************************************** nNCL: registering deferred (0) .//run-mozilla.sh: line 29: 10480 Segmentation fault $prog ${1+"$@"} I have a similar problem with SuSe 6.2. I managed to find and install the LibJpeg.so file version 6.2 which Mozilla now seems to require and adjust the LD_Library_Path to include these files but I now get the message "Gtk-WARNING **: cannot open display:". Any SuSe user with any ideas or solutions, Mozilla was working fine up to M11. |